I'm going to be referring to the lovely lj community fatshionista a fair amount in this blog, as it is the source for a lot of the material I find on fat stigmatisation.
Also, as a general disclaimer, I'll be using the word "stigmatisation" to refer to a whole manner of things (including ignorance, unfairness, unprecedented judgements and unjustified opinions) that stem from a negative attitude towards fat people.
Amongst the many posts on fatshionista today was this one, which pointed us fashion-loving fatties towards a plus-sized model featured in the French version of Elle magazine. I've got to say, I was impressed by Elle's balls here. I mean, if fat stigmatisation in countries like England and America is bad, I can only imagine how much it's stigmatised in France, where obesity is not as prevalent. Certainly obesity is very stigmatised here in Japan, but only in reference to Japanese people - they're cool with us foreigners being fat. Double standards, huh?
What was I talking about? Oh yeah, this plus-sized model. She's a size 18 UK (so maybe about a 16 in American sizing), and she appears to be quite tall, but as I was not able to find out her height in 1 minute's worth of google searching, I deemed the task irrelevant (my laziness scares even me sometimes) and moved on. To say that she is pretty would be doing her an incredible injustice, I feel:
She's fucking GORGEOUS. I realise that this invites a whole wave of people to say that I must be one of those types who thinks that people are only beautiful if they have curves... rubbish. Cameron Diaz is one of the most beautiful women in the world and she has few curves to speak of. Keira Knightley has fewer still, and Anne Hathaway isn't the curviest of individuals. You don't have to have a body like Angelina Jolie or Anna Paquin to be gorgeous, and Tara Lynn here certainly seems to be doing her part to promote her side of the scale, as it were.
(This just in: she's 176cm. So yeah, pretty tall)
So there I was, enjoying the photos in the 20-page Tara-esque spread (worth checking out, btw. There are some nice photos there, including a nude shot that I didn't really see much point to, because it is, you know, a FASHION magazine, where fashion generally equals CLOTHING, but whatever, she looks fabulous in it as well), and I decided to go back to LJ and tell the fattie (that's what we call ourselves on fatshionista) thank you for the link. The other comments already on there talked about negative comments directed towards our heavy-set babe here.
Oh Lord, here we go, I thought to myself. Because I am a curious kitten, I obviously now absolutely HAD to have a look through the comments. Some of them upset me, I won't lie. It's amazing how ignorant people can be. But some of them made me raise a somewhat curious eyebrow. So I thought I'd post a few on here.
She's really pretty, but I'd like her a little thinner. Not twiggy, mind you, just about 20 pounds less.
If she was 20 lbs less she wouldn't have a job. She'd be too big for regular modeling and too thin for plus size modeling. I think 20 lbs less would be better for her health wise, but not career wise.
There were a lot of comments like this. "She's pretty, but she'd be prettier if she was thinner" sort of thing. A lot of them had the "not Twiggy!" angle, but I still think you're doing her an injustice by saying that she should lose any weight. This brings about the whole point a lot of people are trying to make in the FA movement: Why? Why would she look better if she was just a little thinner? Would she REALLY look better if she was just a little thinner? I don't think it would make very much difference at all, quite frankly. 20lb less would probably be bad for her career though, I'll accept that. In fact, I would have liked this comment if the poster had not posted "I think 20 lbs less would be better for her health wise". That makes me clutch the bridge of my nose between thumb and forefinger and think angry thoughts, before thinking "No, no, it's not their fault. It's just what society tells them." Fat vs. Health is an issue for another incredibly long blog post, I think.
She looks gorgeous. But she's the exception.
Sadly this person had 79 fans. I'd give them a well-placed "fuck off", but I think the person who commented on their comment summed it up pretty well:
Gorgeous skinny women are the exception, too.
This comment had 258 fans. AND they had correct grammar (that's right, I will become that petty for the sake of this argument)! In your face!
She is beautiful...a woman's body (shapely and curvy), self-confidence, and just plain hot! It's about time we started celebrating real women again! Thanks, Elle!
There were HEAPS of comments talking about Tara being a "real" woman. At this, I again feel the need to place thumb and finger on bridge of nose and pinch slightly. Isn't it about time that we stopped this, people? Don't all of you "real" women out there get sick and tired when the skinny-obsessed media labels you as "too fat"? Don't you think that, by insinuating that the willow-like people of the world are somehow "not real", that you're doing the same sort of negative categorising that the media does to you? I mean, I know skinny people, and most of them are pretty real-seeming to me. I think it's unfair to say that an ectomorph with about as much ability to become round and curvaceous as an endomorph has at becoming lean, is "not real". Don't get me wrong - it's wrong to put them on high pedestals as well - but I think we can be better than this. People are people. We come in all shapes and sizes, and THAT should be celebrated.
FANTASTIC - and I will be bookmarking for motivation (or seeing if I can order a hard copy). She's probably 20-30 lbs heavier than I was in college, but [now] I'm up about 60 lbs. Pictures of the ridulously skinny are of no help - I couldn't get there when I was healthy and an athlete, so I certainly won't get there now. But maybe, just maybe -- if I can cut down ... -- I could achieve this and love it! Thanks, Elle, for showing beauty in a different size.
You're so not helping, dude. What's wrong with your current weight? The whole POINT (I thought!) about this was that it was showing beauty as achievable in a variety of sizes. Not just in skinny people and not just in people like Tara! You, too, are beautiful, with your 60lb more than Tara.
And I'm really starting to hate when people talk about "cutting down" on food intake, as though it's a really good thing. Most people are pretty bloody good at naturally eating, more or less, what their body requires. "Cutting down" means that your body is consuming LESS than what it requires. That is NOT a good thing!
Beautiful face but I'm sorry I don't want her body.
Only posting this one because I enjoyed the reply:
thanks so much for the same hackneyed "but you have such a pretty face" that we plus size woman have heard all our lives
You go girl.
How is a big roll of belly fat sexy or beautiful?
Dunno. Just is. How is being a jerk helping to extend your cock size?
I don't think women are sexy at that size.
I don't think women are sexy at a size 0, 2, 4 or 6 either.
I also think that the fashion media should show women of all sizes, shapes and colors.
I absolutely agree with the third line. I added the first two to show that nobody's perfect. :P
She has a pretty face but she is also overweight so this is really no better than featuring anorexic looking models. Thin women, athletic women, and average sized women are all "real" too you know. Shouldn't we be pressing for health instead, a happy medium between overweight and anorexic? All I know is this woman could not run a mile without stopping...
Oh piss off. You can't just look at a person's shape and immediately know whether they're healthy or unhealthy. I agree that in-betweeners need to be in these mags too, but that doesn't stop you from being a judgemental prick. I hope she CAN run a mile without stopping, just to show you up.
Love this reply to that comment:
You do not "know" that at all. You assume that. I'm "overweight," "plus-size," "fat," etc ., and I am healthier than most of the "skinny" people I know. I walk everywhere (don't own a car), bike, walk stairs for exercise, etc. Fat does not equal unhealthy, just as skinny doesn't mean healthy.
...
Beauty comes in all shapes and sizes...most importantly, it comes from within. And all the haters here, regardless of how "healthy" they are, seem pretty ugly to me
What the dick does health have to do with any of this anyway? It's a FASHION magazine, ffs!
My mother use to say,some dog's like meat on there bone's LOL!!!!!
And MY mother used to say "Gillian, if you ever use an apostrophe on a plural I will kick you out of this house."
No thank you. Fat is not attractive, nor is it healthy. And anyone that says "Yay, finally someone that looks like a real woman." needs to go on a diet.
This arsehole has a picture of Quagmire as his avatar. I think it suits, although Quagmire occasionally, you know, has a heart.
Believe me, buddy. There are PLENTY of skinny people out there who prefer their women (and men!) chunky, and even, occasionally, fat. And I would quite honestly fear for these skinny peoples' lives if they decided to go on diets. There are plenty out there who think that fat is VERY attractive, and if you want to go into the purely perverted side of it, check out some of the porn out there featuring overweight people. There are actual humans out there whacking off to that shit, because they think it's HOT. Truly the world has gone topsy-turvy.
As a woman on the lighter scale of normal, I don't understand the obsession with weight. She is beautiful for who she is whether skinny or overweight. There are beautiful women who are overweight, there are beautiful women who are skinny. This woman would be beautiful if she were 20 pounds lighter too. Trying to say that women have to be round to be womanly is the other extreme of the scale where you have to be skinny to be beautiful. It's just the same kind of thinking with a different vocabulary. Stop obsessing with weight, then the true beauty will show.
This. ... So. Much. This.
And I'm quoting it last because I think it sums up my beliefs really well. I think this person has pretty much hit the nail on the head. Letting beauty be controlled by your size and shape is a bad way to go about doing things, because nobody is able to absolutely 100% perfectly sculpt themselves into any shape that is out there. It is cold, hard, unchangeable, undeniable genetics that dictates, for the most part, how we look. And it's sad when people spend so much of their time trying to deny the body that has been sculpted for them through billions of years of evolution, rather than trying to use the features that they've been given to make themselves look and feel both beautiful and unique.
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